Prejudice against Weckl

[Derek DeFields]

Also, from what I've read, Omar went looking for the gig not the other way around. Vinnie was recommended by Robben.

I don't think it was Sting saying, "wow, I really enjoyed Vinnie Colaiuta's playing on Jeff Beal's album. I would hire Dave, but his swing playing is a little stiff for my music." [img]graemlins/sure.gif[/img]

Sting just hires good players that he likes. I'm sure Manu was recommended by Peter Gabriel, Dominic or Dave Sancious. For that group he basically stole Peter's band.

Don't think that Sting follows the freelance musician scene. While I have no evidence to support it, I sincerely doubt he knows (or cares) who the hot instrumental players are.

Point being, Sting not calling Dave is not a reflection on his abilities. I'm sure if Dave was in the right circles and wanted the gig, he'd at least get a shot at it.

[PencilZ]

Derek, Dave does talk about the Sting gig in an interview with Rhythm magazine. Trouble is i dont have it and, i cant remember what he said (apart from he's love to play with him). [img]frown.gif[/img]

[Derek DeFields]

I'm sure he would. Notice I said "if he was in the right circles AND wanted the gig."

My point not being that Dave doesn't want to play with pop musicians. My point was that you have to look at the chain of events that led up to Vinnie (who Dave was being compared to) playing with pop musicians, in this case Sting.

It didn't come from Sting saying, I need a new drummer and I heard this guy Vinnie Colaiuta is insane. It came from him asking his friends if they knew anyone and Robben saying Vinnie. (just like a lot of us have probably gotten gigs in our own towns. :-)

[palmerlouie]

i have that intertview and thats what i was talking about in an earlier post. He just said if sting called tomorrow he'd probably go, but he is not on really on the market for those kind of gigs cause of his involvement with his own band.........

by the way when was the last time weckl was on the cover of modern drummer? the rhythm interview was ages ago and was crap and way too short! same for vinnie and virgil......why arent these guys on the cover?!

[helpmate]

I'd rather listen to Vinnie, but I'd rather watch Dave. Let me explain:

I've only seen Vinnie once. Much of his playing is SO fast that the eyes cannot 'see' it. Only the ears can hear it. Those quick and tasty fills are what sets Vinnie apart. He plays for the ears, as do most drummers.

Dave, on the other hand, plays for the EYES. What you hear often looks very different live. Anyone out there heard and seen 'High Life' performed? In the intro, you THINK you hear (on the CD) alternating strokes on 2 bells. But what you SEE is Dave playing singles on FOUR bells, a good 2 feet apart on both sides of the kit, with double-strokes thrown in for color. He plays this in a closed loop with unbelievable control. It's just awesome to watch!

Since the majority of our collective musical enjoyment comes via our ears, this gives Vinnie an edge over Dave. But I'd take a live, visual performance from Dave ANY day.

--Dan

[leedaviesdrums]

Well Dan i think you've summed it up for me 110%

I recently downloaded a vinnie solo clinic from WINMX and yes it sure is blinding but everything is 300mph
but when i see weckl play [img]eek.gif[/img]
He plays so smooth [img]cool.gif[/img]

[PencilZ]

Dave goes for Waxing does he? [img]biggrin.gif[/img] Just his Legs? [img]tongue.gif[/img]

[leedaviesdrums]

Sorry i forgot to mention the VIC FIRTH "POODLE BRUSH" [img]eek.gif[/img]

[SayWhat YouMean]

Man o man, hasn't anyone heard the saying "if you can't say anything good, don't say anything at all"? Prejudice sucks, who gives a rats ass what people look like - height, size, inflection of voice, etc? If they appear to be decent human beings and are making a contribution to society, who cares about their height or voice? I'm a huge fan of both Weckl and Vinnie, I show no preference to either one. I have a real distaste for people who bad mouth others to make themselves feel better. I was fortunate enough to attend a Jazz Improv camp at UMASS many years ago. It was at this camp that I met and studied with Max Roach for two weeks. What a great guy who possessed very little cockiness and arrogance. That can't be said for some of the camps attendees who regularly bashed top notch drummers for no good reason. Blech. On my way home to Illinois from UMass I stopped off at Niagara Falls to visit a friend who worked for Calato at the time. We were fortunate enough to tech for Louie Bellson at a Pearl Bailey gig. Louie couldn't get his kit to NY, so Joe Calato senior furnished one for his gig. I've never met a nicer human being in my life. What a saint! Super cool and very down to earth. Louie borrowed my 20" K Zildjian ride for the gig and was very gracious about it. Louie played some sick brush work during their sound check. He played one flashy and ever so tasty lick with his brushes, and then looked directly at me and smiled with a gleam in his eye. That experience really stuck with me. To see a drumming legend be so nice and unassuming, and take the time to recognize that a drumming peon like myself was really digging his work behind the kit. Here's the kicker - I saw him again with Pearl in Louisville, KY around a year or so after that initial meeting in NY. After the show, several people congregated down at the front of the stage. Who immediately recognized this and gave of his time? You guessed it, Louie! I introduced myself and mentioned the gig in NY several years ago and Louie instantly remebered me. I was floored, I've met other local drummers and musicians in Louisville who won't give you the time of day. And I'm talking about guys playing in cover bands in friggin Louisville, KY!! And there was Louie playing the top venue in this town, and not an ounce of arrogance in his demeanor at all. He even invited me up to help him tear down his kit. What a time, hanging with Louie, talking shop and listening to his stories about all of the heavy weights he's been associated with. What a cool cat! Evertime I hear some snot nosed kid bad mouthing a top notch drummer, I think of my experience with Louie Bellson. It was a real learning experience for me and I'm very grateful for it. The world would be a better place if there were more "Louie's" around. Be kind...

[FuseU1]

The light-hearted jokes, i can handle [u know, the "poodle hairbrush," & whatnot]... this kind of levity is harmless & brings a chuckle to lighten the load, so to speak... i've even thrown out a couple of those... but 4 some1 to bash OR critique Vinnie, Dave, Dennis, or Virg, etc, about their playing or otherwise, well, that person better be a SERIOUSLY SMOKIN' GUN - AS GOOD AS - no, make that BETTER[?!] [img]eek.gif[/img] than ANY of those guys b4 they open their mouth about it... PERIOD, END OF STORY [AGAIN].... [img]graemlins/grrr.gif[/img] ;=) [img]tongue.gif[/img]
[It's OK to talk about personal preferences & what 1 prefers over, say, something else [style, feel, approach, etc] - but to BASH - shows/exposes extreme weakness, insecurity, & issues on the part of the basher [& which, btw, doesn't hurt the "bashee" at all, ESPECIALLY when they play the way they do!] ;=)

...I guess that's why they get hired by other great musicians to record &/or go on tour, & have an audience of listeners, because they suck in some areas - NOT...

...funny, are any of these basher's phones ringing off the hook for the gigs these guys play on?!...

...& as "Say..." just "Said," ever hear what Dave's [& the other guys] other great contemporaries [like Erskine] say about them? Just go back to Erskoman's post on this subj...

I mean, let's get real... each & every guy just mentioned, awa some other players we "speak" of here, on his [or her] own merits, is a REAL, HARDCORE, SHIFT-KICKIN' BAD-A**...pushing the boundaries of the limitations of the instrument to the extreme [& perhaps beyond]... & that's Vinnie AND Weckl AND Virgil AND Dennis AND Novak AND Husband AND Lang AND Knight AND Kennedy AND Sanchez AND Horacio [AND Ersko, man [img]wink.gif[/img] ]... [etc]...

btw... Chick Corea hires only THE BEST... & on recommendation of only THE BEST: Erskine & Anthony ["I just played w/ the BEST drummer i've EVER played with!!"] Jackson rec'd Weckl to Chick.... :=p
... & that's my 38.7 cents worth...

PS - only a "basher" will be offended in any way by this post... ;=)... so, "Don't You Be A Flamin' Bastar*-Basher!", cuz "Uncle Sam Don't Want'choo!" [kazeundheit - - t'ank you ever so much].... :=D

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ June 04, 2003 12:23 AM: Message edited by: FuseU1 ]</font>